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Reply-To for mailing lists

Posted: 23 Jan 2007, 10:42
by Admin
I just saw that Reply-to field is totally buggy for mailing lists.
I need to review it at all.
It could be also useful to add a X-Reply-To that in any case a reply-to address would be created and not be overwritten.

Re: Reply-To for mailing lists

Posted: 23 Jan 2007, 11:15
by Z
Sounds good. That's what I have been suggesting for a while. ;)

Posted: 03 Jul 2007, 11:22
by Zandru
i just got a challenge mail from trashmail for posting on a mailing list. obviously a trashmail.net user (urcqugak@trashmail.net) has subscribed to that mailing list and now i as the author of a new message get this confirmation "spam". :cry:

This is just plain wrong. :x - being spammed by someone with the slogan "give spam no chance". :oops:

Maybe you can detect that it's coming from a mailing list and ignore messages from mailing lists completely? (unless they're whitelisted, i guess)

Cheers,
Zandru

Posted: 03 Jul 2007, 12:25
by Admin
Zandru wrote:i just got a challenge mail from trashmail for posting on a mailing list. obviously a trashmail.net user (urcqugak@trashmail.net) has subscribed to that mailing list and now i as the author of a new message get this confirmation "spam". :cry:

This is just plain wrong. :x - being spammed by someone with the slogan "give spam no chance". :oops:

Maybe you can detect that it's coming from a mailing list and ignore messages from mailing lists completely? (unless they're whitelisted, i guess)
Hi,
sorry for this problem. The email address urcqugak@trashmail.net is mine. :-)

The idea was to implement the support of mailing lists that users like you could protect 100% against spam and continue to use mailing list. The problem is the following:
If an user sends an email to foobar@mailinglist.com then it would work.
But if somebody sends the following email:
To: foobar@gmail.com, foobar@mailinglist.com
or
To: foobar@gmail.com
CC: foobar@mailinglist.com
then it would fail because trashmail scans only the "From" and "To" field and currently does not support multiple entries in the To field. CC field is currently also not supported, but I will work on this. In the while I will unsubscribe me from all mailing lists.

Thanks for your notification.

Posted: 06 Jul 2007, 14:00
by Z
Ahem. IMHO! No body will use whitelisting with mailing-lists. But with other public addresses. For mailing list you can open address that you simply subscribe that list to and then that's it. There is usually no problem with spam, and if there is then the list is in some way very bad list.

Posted: 06 Jul 2007, 14:08
by Admin
Z wrote:Ahem. IMHO! No body will use whitelisting with mailing-lists. But with other public addresses. For mailing list you can open address that you simply subscribe that list to and then that's it. There is usually no problem with spam, and if there is then the list is in some way very bad list.
I used whitelisting with the mailing list because I wanted to get only messages from the list and no spam message. When you write a message in the mailing list, then your email address is public and spammer will harvest them. Then you will soon receive emails from the mailing list and spam mails. With the whitelist only mailing list emails will be forwarded. However some users want to sent you directly message for private messages. Then they could confirm it with the whitelisting.

Posted: 06 Jul 2007, 14:13
by Z
Admin wrote: When you write a message in the mailing list, then your email address is public and spammer will harvest them.
Thats true. Naturally you can subscribe list to different address than the address you're using when writing to list. Then you don't suffer from white-listing problem.

That's the method I have been using for long long time.

I order list to my-email-list@trashmail.net and when I write to list I use my-another-address@trashmail.net. So if some one sends reply to list to my message it's fine. I'll get it trough list address. If someone wants to send me spam or write me privatly then they use my-another-address@trashmail.net.

How's that? At least that has been working quite well for me.

It also seems that you changed name to more describing challenge-response option. Thats good. Challenge-Response allows "remote whitelisting".

Posted: 06 Jul 2007, 17:43
by Admin
Z wrote:
Admin wrote: When you write a message in the mailing list, then your email address is public and spammer will harvest them.
Thats true. Naturally you can subscribe list to different address than the address you're using when writing to list. Then you don't suffer from white-listing problem.

That's the method I have been using for long long time.

I order list to my-email-list@trashmail.net and when I write to list I use my-another-address@trashmail.net. So if some one sends reply to list to my message it's fine. I'll get it trough list address. If someone wants to send me spam or write me privatly then they use my-another-address@trashmail.net.

How's that? At least that has been working quite well for me.

It also seems that you changed name to more describing challenge-response option. Thats good. Challenge-Response allows "remote whitelisting".
But is there not the problenm that some mailing lists verify your FROM header before accepting to post a message?
Somebody wrote me to complain about my Challenge-Response system because of the mailing lists, then I discovered on wikipedia that this Whitelisting + Confirmation system has already a name: Challenge-Response Spam Filtering
Now I use the name of wikipedia. :-)
But what do you mean exactly with remote whitelisting? That the remote users add itsself in the whitelist by confirm the email?

Posted: 07 Jul 2007, 18:23
by Z
Admin wrote: But is there not the problenm that some mailing lists verify your FROM header before accepting to post a message?
That's funny, so they are sending challenge and expecting response, but they say there is something wrong about using challenge response... Laugh!!!
Admin wrote:Somebody wrote me to complain about my Challenge-Response system because of the mailing lists, then I discovered on wikipedia that this Whitelisting + Confirmation system has already a name: Challenge-Response Spam Filtering
Yep, that's it. Loved child got many names.
Admin wrote: But what do you mean exactly with remote whitelisting? That the remote users add itsself in the whitelist by confirm the email?
Yes. That's it. It's one way to describe challenge - response system. Users not on address book (white list) are sent message which allows users to confirm that they send that email and get them selves on address book (white list) remotely.

That's the name that Safe-mail.net uses for that service.

Basicly using trusted email addresses are called white listing. And method used to allow remote listing to white list, is challenge responce in your case.

This could be done in email program too. Eudora supports check that is sender is on address book. I can reply automaticly to all messages that I receive which sender isnt on address book. I can send them email telling that they need to send message with subject kalsjdflkaj to get trough. Then I can add that address to my address book. There is only one problem. System then wont forward that original message to me. So sender needs to resend it. But that's not a big problem, if I send my confirmation message with whole received message and expect user to send it back to me as complete, only by changing subject line.

But I'm now very happy with trashmail. Because I don't like scripting like that. And especially for ahem... Computer technology handicapped it's way too complex. Try to explain that to your GF or Grand Mother(tm). ;)

I have told you earlier to read from wikipedia at least these articles... ;)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Spam_filtering

Many many different methods to fight spam.

But I presonally prefer C-R because it's sure. It's 100% sure that spam wont get trough, and it's quite sure that any important message gets trough... If sender just understands the challenge... Which has been bit unclear as you have seen.

Safe-mail also supports safe-box feature. Which doesnt even send message to recipient, but sends link to message. Allowing actual content of message to be transmitted over SSL.

Posted: 10 Jul 2007, 07:42
by Admin
Z wrote: But I'm now very happy with trashmail.
That makes me also happy, there was a lot of work to do to make you happy as you are now. :-)

Safe-mail also supports safe-box feature. Which doesnt even send message to recipient, but sends link to message. Allowing actual content of message to be transmitted over SSL.[/quote]

I would like to add also this feature.
At the end we would have complete email solution (not only forwarding...). :D

Re: Reply-To for mailing lists

Posted: 24 Jun 2009, 14:49
by Admin
Challenge-Response System and whitelist for mailing lists should be reviewed for later.
I close this bug.